WomanSavers.com Forum / GENERAL / Sleeping with guys right away - opinions?

Awwwwwwa thank you Wire! And yeah I added more to my post, I can‘t help it, my mind seems to reel and reel >_<

       I think wayyyyyy too much for my own better judgement!

People should do what they feel is right for themselves even if others do not deem it satifactory or they see it morally acceptable.

                       Got to love being diplomatic!

"I know that there are men out there who are lazy and expect the woman to do all the work, but... realisitcally, if I were your son and had just started dating, would you try to convince me that there isn‘t a connection between how much money I make and how many women solicit my attention?"

I‘d probably warn you about a lot more than that.

I guess I would have to ask what kind of women are "soliciting" your attention.  Of course, there are gold diggers out there.  But there are a helluva lot of women that aren‘t.  How do they know how much money you make?  Are you bragging about what you do for a living?  Are you sporting a flashy car?  Wearing fancy duds?  Struttin‘ like you‘re "the man?"  Guys like that WILL attract certain kinds of women.

But then what are you looking at?  Hot babes?  Eye candy?  Like attracts like.  There is a reason that Donald Trump and Johnny Carson married young and beautiful.  It wouldn‘t be prestigious to be married to someone who was as old as they are.  Part of the "power" trip they are on includes the "trophy wife."

I guess if someone asked me what I do for a living (and they do) I‘d tell them.  But if I even remotely "suspected" that that was the reason for their interest, I would question whether that was someone I wanted to get to know better.  I would only want to be with someone who liked me for me. 

Likewise - if someone blew me off because my job wasn‘t fancy enough, or they don‘t like the way I dress, I don‘t lose sleep over it.  I don‘t need people like that.

Superficial people are everywhere.  There are lots of sweet women there that just want to be with a nice guy who will treat them well.  Lots of people are still getting married these days - and women are marrying car mechanics, tire installers, insurance salesmen, and even WalMart employees. 

"There are users and parasites on both sides."

Exactly!  Don‘t kid yourself that aren‘t a ton of men out there living off of women to avoid paying child support, staying on unemployment because it‘s easier to collect a check for doing nothing than it is for them to get off their ass, or are waiting to "find themselves."  I know several female "heads of households" supporting men like this, and have been there in the past myself.  No more.

Your problem, Wire, is that you make a sweeping generalization about "all" women and "all" men.

But it seems that mostly on the male side are parents telling their children to watch out for the golddiggers."

Uh-huh.  Not always.

My dad told me that if they don‘t work, they‘re no damn good.  I was never a golddigger, and none of the women in my family have been, either.

I guess that kind of thinking is very foreign to me.  I would rather work for something and earn it myself than to wheedle, cajole, and try to snare some man. 

Here is what I told my daughters (all 3 of them):

1)  Do well in school, graduate, think about what you want to do for a living.  Expect that you are always going to have to work.  Always be in a position where you can support yourself and you never have to ask a man for money. 

2) Know how to take care of yourself.  Every woman has to expect that she is going to end up alone at some point in her life.  One in two marriages ends in divorce.  Men often die before women.  Things happen.  Most families today are two income households. Do not rely on a man to take care of you.

3)  A relationship should be a choice.  NOT a life sentence.

4)  Be responsible about birth control and the use of condoms.  Never trust anyone but yourself when it comes to being safe.  Be aware that a 15 minute bad choice can result in a ruined life.

5)  Do NOT put up with a man who refuses to work. Any job is better than no job.  He shouldn‘t be too proud to dig ditches if it puts food on the table. 

6)  Think about what you want to do for a living.  It is much easier to work at a job you like, and do what you love than it is to suffer at a job you hate.

Is any of this about being a golddigger?  I think not.  My feeling is - and has always been - that it‘s best to be independent - financially and emotionally. 

Wire:  I can relate.  I come from a long line of working class folks on my father‘s side, and first generation immigrants on my mother‘s side.

I wasn‘t brought up with a sense of "entitlement" either.

My parents worked very hard for everything they had, and told me that I should expect to do the same.  There was no "silver spoon" in my mouth.

I think they did me a favor.  They taught me about life the way it really is.  Since the emphasis was on "earning" things myself, I grew to have a lot of dreams and ambitions and was willing to work hard for them.  So it is insulting to me when a man says all women are gold diggers.

The problem is when we start to polarize.  I think it happens from dating too many bad apples.  You come to think all men are alike, or all women are alike, when really, what‘s going on is that you‘re picking the same kinds of people over and over.

There are a lot of jerks in the dating world.  Bad experiences can sour one‘s perspective.  It can leave such a bad taste in your mouth that you end up blowing off  the people who are really worth getting to know.

Back to the original poster - I hope that your future experiences are more positive.  Try not sleeping with anybody for a while, and just have fun, and get to know these guys.  Dating is supposed to be fun, not miserable.

 Thank you but in honesty I am just being me. And I have always been the gothic odd one out of every socail affair so. A wall flower - the strange one-..> the dreamer< I learned over time to calculate and read things from a distance. I don‘t see things normally like most people would see things and I have always been that way. One person may look at a bird and say it‘s a bird, but in my thoroughgoing need to investigate, I imagine what that bird has seen, where has it been? I do not see people in the views of what gender they are, what socail status they have aquired because we all deserve chances no matter what scandal or affair he or she has committed we are all of the same species and we all have to coinhibbit this place we call home whether we like it or not,it‘s what we ourselves personally make of this life - and yes even my down right failed husband deserves happiness.

I once thought, after my brother was burried, I thought, how would people remember me when I am gone? Everything we do has an impact , ripples on the surface of the lake, the butterfly effect theory so why not make it positive?

 To hold expecations of someone to be considered as our future significant others for our own needs doesn;t leave many options open!((I‘m not looking for another significant other, if anything I may just be an emotional lesbian ( unsexual lesbian!)) Again if someone had such high expectations of me, I wouldn;t feel good enough! We need to hold expectations for ourselves before placing them on others, I say explore! Leave doors open for new possibilities and not shut out the future due to fear or because of what has happened in the past. To live in the past and calculate things in the future according to what has already happens isn;t living, only living in fear..

I still plan on going into the army. Am I scared? Hell yeah I am! But would I not do it because of that fear...no..I say bring it on!

I‘m an artist ( painting, computer graphics, charcoal, portraits, pencil, ink) so I see things in different potentail lights I guess and as you can tell I‘m a writer>_> and I ramble so before I make this longer than it is I will end it here to save all of you the hassel of reading my stuff.

P.s: Do what is right for yourselves and not others ( unless you have kids)

I say make apple pie with all of those bad apples, or maybe a nice cup of apple sauce. :)

 What I mean is, we all have bad experiences but it‘s what we do and learn from that experience that makes a difference.

VV---------------general opinions-----------------VV

>_> sometimes things go to poop, and it smells.

But what comes out of poop are roses if tended right.

 We shouldn;t judge others on their sexual preferences. If Donald Trump wants to bang an 18 year old and she is willing I say GO FOR IT! Have fun!

We have one life to live and that‘s it.

 I was young once and was in that kind of position, ( I worked 60 hours a week at this little fruit stand in NewPort beach. I had no car, I had no place to live ( yeah I was actually homeless) but I was also catered as arm candy, and I had a blast because I was able to experience it!

And I was never really looked down upon by these men as insignificant because of my uprising in the ghetto, or  even because I had to walk to work everyday.

Again it‘s about what others feel is right for themselves and nobody should hold judgement to it especailly not knowing the whole circumstance involved.. 

 I just don;t know who we are as people to judge others for what they want to do when we ourselves do not like critisism or being judged upon.

 So what if I want to dress in latex and publically show off my dominatrix skills against some man who is willing by the strike of my cat of nine tails or a rubber pylon in a seedy Hollywood club?(( yeah for being 29 i‘m way too experienced for my own good an eccentric aristrocrat even)) Would you all think of me differently? Even if you knew I was part of the P.T.A...have children? Doing homework and well rounded?

People have different wants and needs from our  own personal wants, so again who are we to judge and hold opinions on what is right for anyone else but ourselves?

Survived - First of all, I wasn‘t judging you or anything you had to say.

Second of all, your life experience is your life experience.  I offer no criticisms one way or another.  Like you, I am presenting a point of view.

What I was taking exception to is the insinuation that all women are gold diggers.  Just as I think many of the men here take exception to women saying all men are users, or all men are jerks - with good reason.  I have problems with sweeping generalizations. 

I was also pointing out that many of us form opinions based on life experience.  ‘Nuff said!

 WOW all I said was positive things! I never stated you said anything towards me BUT LIKE YOU I too was giving my opinions in a positive notation IN GENERAL! That nobody has a right to judge others! Without knowing exactly what the circumstance is. Which if you miss read my post was meaning to AGREE with you!

 And by saying making apple pies with sours apples is a good thing, by making something negative into something positive. ( that was the only part I quoted) Perhaps I should have made a notation of what was general in my context???

 Not entirely my fault if you got defenssive through your own perception of what I was saying.

P.s I edited the recent post to clear some of the things up hope this helps                  

                                     Enough said! :)

(( had to go back and fix my grammatical errors and since i‘m here , I want to check this out as well.))

anyone has a "right" to judge.  and judging in itself isn‘t a bad thing.

just those who are doing the judging on certain situations best better make sure they aren‘t being hypocrites.

I won‘t judge anyone on things, as you were talking about earlier, such as sexual preferences, or any other kind of preference that doesn‘t involve hurting someone else.

But when it comes to things like cheating, sleeping with someone elses spouse...you bet I‘m going to judge.

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone??  Well I am without those 2 sins that involve betraying and hurting other people......so I‘m picking up a damn rock!

 Again it depends on circumstances. Cheating is never a good outcome and will only lead up to dissapointments and a hard fall in the end. But instead of judging, why not guide? And offer helpful advice?

      My husband has cheated on me...

Even though he denies it, but the proof of ladies underwear was in my laundry. Did I judge? No but trust was no longer an option nor was sex..and it has been almost two years, and it takes alot to not go after the other woman, does it make her a horrible person? I don;t think so, Maybe she didn;t know he was married, is that her fault?

       Everyone has their own opinion but what is sacred is that others are tolerable to them and can respect it.

I try to give everyone a benifit of a doubt

        -pokes teasingly- even you... after you made me cry. 

    I‘m just saying to judge wisely and gather facts before making such judgments on anyone without knowing all the details. And there are always two sides of every story. Sometimes, three or even four sides >_<

 And you seem very hurt and betrayed. I am sorry that you are and nobody deserves to carry that kind of pain, and it‘s okay to feel this way. But remember, you may pick up that stone to chuck it..but karma has a way to rebound it seven pence.

 The Salem witch trails was due to strong judgment that people were witches and many died due to those judgements.

    It‘s 1-30 in the morning and I have to get up at 7.

                       I know i‘m barely making sense due to lack of sleep so night night for me.

Again it depends on circumstances. Cheating is never a good outcome and will only lead up to dissapointments and a hard fall in the end. But instead of judging, why not guide? And offer helpful advice?

What helpful advice would I give to someone that blames their "victim" for their own choice to cheat, or give advice to someone who sleeps with someone elses spouse and has no remorse about it?

Like someone here named Sarasota...she didn‘t have remorse for sleeping with someones husband, and she didn‘t have any remorse for cheating on her husband.

      My husband has cheated on me...

Even though he denies it, but the proof of ladies underwear was in my laundry. Did I judge? No but trust was no longer an option nor was sex

Whether you want to believe it or not, withholding sex and not trusting him IS a form of judgement.  But hey, I don‘t blame you one bit for doing either.

and it has been almost two years, and it takes alot to not go after the other woman does it make her a horrible person?

yes...unless she didn‘t know he was married AND feels horrible about it

Maybe she didn;t know he was married, is that her fault?

again, see above

       Everyone has their own opinion but what is sacred is that others are tolerable to them and can respect it.

I try to give everyone a benifit of a doubt

       -pokes teasingly- even you... after you made me cry. 

again, my apologies...was not my intention

    I‘m just saying to judge wisely and gather facts before making such judgments on anyone without knowing all the details.

with regards to cheating, there are NO details that make a difference in that person being a slimeball.

and the ONLY detail as far as spouse screwers, is if they didn‘t know the MM/MW was married

  No not having sex with my husband means I am protecting myself from possible stds meaning I do not trust the desicions that he has made. I have to think of the children and myself and how that can effect us because of his irresponsible decisions. It isn;t judgement.

Catching a disease that he might carry isn‘t really called judging lol.

 Most of the time - not all of the time- women and men who are in a cheating relationship with our significant others started out not knowing that our significant others were infact married. A double life.

 People seem to always direct anger towards the other that our significant others cheated with, and forgive 90% okay 75% of the time their significants.over the one they cheated with..why is that?

 I ask myself alot.

 Again like I have stated over and time again that it just depends on the situation,and the personalities involved,

  Your apology was accepted and I am sure you will be underline everything I have to say and quote on it. I guess I can call you my personal fan?

Most of the time - not all of the time- women and men who are in a cheating relationship with our significant others started out not knowing that our significant others were infact married. A double life.

When you say "started out not knowing that our significant others were infact married" are you saying that you are with your husband because he was married before when you were seeing him, and now he is your husband?

People seem to always direct anger towards the other that our significant others cheated with, and forgive 90% okay 75% of the time their significants.over the one they cheated with..why is that?

Not me, I told my OM that I wanted to take him out for a beer for taking my xWife off my hands, that he did me a favor, and better him than me

so basically, nobody has any obligation to afford a married person human decency.....therefore their spouse is fair game?

uh........ok.

 Do you really think that low of women?

 First off. I met my husband back in 1998 when I was working as a cashier at this place he often visited, I was 18 he was 21, we both never been married. there was only two years that we were seperated back in 2003 after my brother was murdered because he couldn;t handle my break downs and left me in an hospital ( actually broke off our engamenet while I was in there) while in the mean while he filed for full custody of my daughter.

   What I had meant by that statement is that alot of women or MEN who cheat with our significant others started out not knowing they were infact married.

 Seeing that you follow me from thread to thread and focus on every statement I make like a bible and quote on them is a bit stalkerish.