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Fifi Larue
  Posted: 1/30/2008 5:09 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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ok, i have a question....

i went for my yearly pap test a couple weeks ago. they told me they would call if anything came back. as i have never had an abnormal pap test, i thought everything was fine....until they called last friday.

they informed me that i had some "abnormal cells" and that they were sometimes consistant with HPV...so as i was sitting on the phone...clutching my stomach in fear...she goes on to say they decided to give me an more thorough HPV screen...and the good news was, it came back negative.

so....as im catching my breath...i asked her, "then why in the hell did you call me and freak me out like this?"...and she said they just wanted to let me know everything looked fine, and that the abnormal cells could be from ANYTHING like my body repairing itself from a problem....etc etc...

soooo....my question is....what causes an abnormal cells on your pap....and why isnt the doctor worried? the nurse told me that i should just come for my pap next year and theres nothing for me to worry about....but i cant help it!

what ELSE besides HPV or another VD could cause abnormal cells?

 



uberbeotch
  Posted: 1/31/2008 12:10 AM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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That‘s a good question, Fifi. I am wondering the same thing.

My pap came back ASCUS last May (abnormal squamous cells of undetermined significance). My doc had me come back in 6 months (not a year) for another pap. I did, and it also came back ASCUS. The lab automatically tests for HPV if you come back ASCUS, and my report said "HPV not detected" (whew! sigh of relief).

 But the report said "inflammation" & ASCUS, so my doc had me come in last week for a colposcopy. She took a look inside me with the miscroscope & took samples from all around my cervix. She didn‘t say anything while she was looking. She‘s supposed to call me when the results come in, in about a week from now.

Did your doc recommend you come back in 1 year? I‘d insist on 6 months, max.

I am also anxious to hear what may cause ASCUS besides HPV or STD‘s. Everything I found on the web mentions HPV, STD‘s, but not much else.

Dr. WS???

UB



GoodBye
  Posted: 1/31/2008 3:31 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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I heard that if you have sex the day before the papsmear the results will be abnormal also if you douche.  In the past my doctor always told me to stay away from doing those things the day before my papsmear.

Dr.WomanSaverM.D.
  Posted: 1/31/2008 9:21 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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Fifi Larue wrote:

ok, i have a question....

i went for my yearly pap test a couple weeks ago. they told me they would call if anything came back. as i have never had an abnormal pap test, i thought everything was fine....until they called last friday.

they informed me that i had some "abnormal cells" and that they were sometimes consistant with HPV...so as i was sitting on the phone...clutching my stomach in fear...she goes on to say they decided to give me an more thorough HPV screen...and the good news was, it came back negative.

so....as im catching my breath...i asked her, "then why in the hell did you call me and freak me out like this?"...and she said they just wanted to let me know everything looked fine, and that the abnormal cells could be from ANYTHING like my body repairing itself from a problem....etc etc...

soooo....my question is....what causes an abnormal cells on your pap....and why isnt the doctor worried? the nurse told me that i should just come for my pap next year and theres nothing for me to worry about....but i cant help it!

what ELSE besides HPV or another VD could cause abnormal cells?

 



Hi Fifi Larue
"what ELSE besides HPV or another VD could cause abnormal cells?" 
Good question.  And as you probably already know the most common cause of cellular changes which could possibly lead to cervical cancer is HPV.  I would say HPV is detected in about 95% of all squamous cell cancers of the cervix.  Up until now there have been over a hundred types of HPV discovered.  The lower numbered ones like HPV 6, and 11 cause benign genital warts, and usually regress in a majority of cases.  The higher numbered ones like HPV 16, 18, 31, 33, 35 and a few others are the ones which are associated with cervical changes which can progress to cervical cancer, but this usually takes around 8-10 years.  This is why we do a PAP smears -to detect these changes and take care of them before they have the chance to progress on to cancer. 

If you had an abnormal PAP and then an HPV test which came back negative, you probably did not have one of the "bad" types of HPV, and you can follow up with your doctor in a year or as often as they suggest.

Getting back to your question: There are other "Risk Factors" for cervical cancer which are:
1.  First intercourse at a young age.  This is because the young cervix is more prone to HPV infection.  Thus the vaccine now given to women around their teens-twenties to prevent cervical cancer.
2.  Multiple sexual partners.  The more partners one has the higher the risk of getting HPV.
3.  Cigarette Smoking.  Some studies have shown that the by-products of cigarette smoke end up in cervical mucus and deplete macrophages which are the good "pac-man" like cells that clean up the area and help to maintain the T-Zone of the cervix, where most cervical cancers occur.
4.  Immunosupression -due to HIV or anything else which depresses the immune system can make one more prone to HPV.
(All of the above are not direct causes, but they do increase your risk of getting HPV and cervical cancer)

I hope this helps... Let me know if you have any more questions.
-DrWS


Dr.WomanSaverM.D.
  Posted: 1/31/2008 9:29 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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uberbeotch wrote:

That‘s a good question, Fifi. I am wondering the same thing.

My pap came back ASCUS last May (abnormal squamous cells of undetermined significance). My doc had me come back in 6 months (not a year) for another pap. I did, and it also came back ASCUS. The lab automatically tests for HPV if you come back ASCUS, and my report said "HPV not detected" (whew! sigh of relief).

 But the report said "inflammation" & ASCUS, so my doc had me come in last week for a colposcopy. She took a look inside me with the miscroscope & took samples from all around my cervix. She didn‘t say anything while she was looking. She‘s supposed to call me when the results come in, in about a week from now.

Did your doc recommend you come back in 1 year? I‘d insist on 6 months, max.

I am also anxious to hear what may cause ASCUS besides HPV or STD‘s. Everything I found on the web mentions HPV, STD‘s, but not much else.

Dr. WS???

UB



Hi UB.
There are a few different follow up options for the different results of a PAP smear.  When your doctor does a PAP smear, they are looking for abnormalities associated with the risk of developing cervical cancer.  These abnormalities can range from just mildly abnormal to precancerous to definite cancer, and this is a spectrum of change. 

From slightly abnormal to worst this is basically how it goes:
1.  ASC-US -Atypical Squamous Cells of Undetermined Significance
2.  ASC-H -High grade changes
3.  LSIL -Low Grade Squamous Intraepithelial Lesions
4.  HSIL - High Grade Squamous Intraepithelial Lesions
5.  Cancer -based on biopsy, is reported as numbered stages -bad to worst depending on how deep and far the cancer has spread. 

For the higher grade ones like ASC-H to Cancer, your doctor will most likely go straight to Colposcopy and Biopsy. 

For ASC-US, your doctor would want to do two things:
1.  A repeat PAP in 4-6 months -until two consecutive negative PAPs.  If the repeat PAP shows ASC-US agian or worse, then a Colposcopy would be suggested.
2.  Check for HPV.  If the "bad" or precancerous type of HPV are found, again a Colposcopy would be recommended.

Colposcopy is a procedure whereby your doctor can see your cervix magnified around 10-12 times to visualize any abnormal changes or precancerous lesions.  At this time, your doctor can also take some samples in and around the cervix. 

Based on the combined results of your PAP smear and your Colposcopy, your doctor will determine how to proceed further.  Some options would be: LEEP (Loop Electrosurgical Excision Procedure), Cryotherapy, Laser Vaporization or Cone Biopsy.  More on this later if you need. 

These are just the general guidelines.  Your doctor may decide to do something different based on your individual case.

I hope this helps in understanding your PAP test and other procedures.  Good luck for your colposcopy results and keep me posted on the outcome.
-DrWS




Dr.WomanSaverM.D.
  Posted: 1/31/2008 9:32 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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GoodBye wrote:
I heard that if you have sex the day before the papsmear the results will be abnormal also if you douche.  In the past my doctor always told me to stay away from doing those things the day before my papsmear.


Yes thats right...
Here is some info on PAP smears from: http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/pap-smear/HQ01177


Pap smear: Screening test for cervical cancer

Understand the importance of the Pap smear, including how it‘s done, what it means when it‘s abnormal and why it needs to be part of your regular health checkups.

A Pap smear, also called a Pap test, is a simple procedure that collects cells from your cervix — the lower, narrow end of your uterus. Named after its developer, George Papanicolaou, M.D., the test effectively detects not only cervical cancer, but also changes in your cervical cells that suggest cancer may develop in the future. Detecting these cells early is your first step in halting the possible development of cervical cancer.

Since women started having Pap smears more than 50 years ago, the number of deaths from cervical cancer has dropped dramatically. What was once the leading cause of cancer death for women in the United States now ranks as No. 15. According to the American Cancer Society, about 3,700 women die each year of cervical cancer — a figure that could drop even further if more women had the Pap smear on a regular basis.

If you get regular Pap smears, you substantially decrease your chances of getting cervical cancer. But even if you develop cervical cancer, the chances of a cure are as high as 90 percent — if discovered early. The Pap smear is the best tool to detect cervical cancer in its earliest stage.

Who should have a Pap smear?

The American Cancer Society recommends that you have your first Pap smear about three years after first having sexual relations or at age 21. After age 21, the guidelines are as follows:

Age Frequency
21 to 29 Once a year using the regular Pap smear or every two years using the liquid-based Pap test.
30 to 69 Every two to three years if you‘ve had three normal Pap smears in a row.
70 and older You may stop having Pap smears if you‘ve had normal results three tests in a row and you‘ve had normal Pap smears over the past 10 years.

Regardless of your age, if you have certain risk factors you‘ll need to be screened annually. These risk factors include:

  • A history of sexual activity as a teenager, especially if you had more than one sex partner
  • Multiple sex partners now
  • A partner who began sexual activity at an early age or who had many previous sexual partners
  • A history of a sexually transmitted disease
  • A family history of cervical cancer
  • A diagnosis of cervical cancer or a Pap smear that showed precancerous cells
  • Infection with human papillomavirus (HPV)
  • Tobacco use
  • Exposure to diethylstilbestrol (DES) before birth
  • HIV infection
  • Weakened immune system due to such factors as an organ transplant, chemotherapy or chronic corticosteroid use

If you‘ve had a total hysterectomy — surgical removal of the uterus including the cervix — ask your doctor if you need to continue having Pap smears. If your hysterectomy was performed for a noncancerous condition, such as fibroids, you may be able to discontinue routine Pap smears. If your hysterectomy was for a precancerous or cancerous condition, your vaginal canal still should be checked for abnormal changes.

Preparing for a Pap smear

To ensure that your Pap smear is most effective, follow these tips prior to your test:

  • Avoid intercourse, douching or using any vaginal medicines or spermicidal foams, creams or jellies for two days before having a Pap smear, as these may wash away or obscure abnormal cells.
  • Try not to schedule a Pap smear during your menstrual period. Although the test can be done, it‘s best to avoid this particular time of your cycle.

How is a Pap smear done?

A Pap smear is performed in your doctor‘s office and takes only a few minutes. First you lie down on an exam table with your knees bent. Your heels rest in supports called stirrups. Your doctor will gently insert an instrument called a speculum into your vagina. Then he or she will take a sample of your cervical cells and smear them onto a glass slide for microscopic examination.

Your doctor will send the slide to a laboratory, where a cytotechnologist — a person trained to detect abnormal cells — will examine the sample. These technicians work in cooperation with a pathologist — a doctor who specializes in cellular abnormalities. The pathologist is responsible for the final diagnosis.

A newer approach uses a liquid to transfer the sample of cells to the laboratory. Your doctor collects the cells in exactly the same way, but then he or she rinses the instruments in a special liquid, which preserves the cells for examination later. When this sample reaches the laboratory, a technician prepares a microscopic slide that‘s cleaner and more easily interpreted than slides prepared in the traditional method.

Usually your doctor performs a Pap smear during a pelvic examination — a simple procedure that allows your doctor to examine your external genitals, uterus, ovaries, other reproductive organs and rectum. Although pelvic examinations can screen for reproductive problems or abnormalities, only a Pap smear will detect early cervical cancer or precancers.

Your test results

The Pap smear doesn‘t diagnose a disease but instead acts as a screening test to alert your doctor to check further. The words used to describe abnormal cells are carefully chosen to send specific messages to your doctor about risk.

Here are some terms your doctor might use and what your next course of action might be:

  • Normal. Your test is negative — no abnormal cells are detected. You won‘t need any further treatment or testing until you‘re due for your next Pap smear and pelvic exam.
  • Atypical squamous cells of undetermined significance. Squamous cells are thin and flat and grow on the surface of a healthy cervix. In this case, the Pap smear reveals slightly abnormal squamous cells, but the changes don‘t clearly suggest that precancerous cells are present. With the liquid-based test, your doctor can reanalyze the sample to check for the presence of viruses known to promote the development of cancer, such as HPV. If no viruses are present, the abnormal cells found as a result of the test aren‘t of great concern. If worrisome viruses are present, you‘ll need further testing.
  • Squamous intraepithelial lesion. This term is used to indicate that the cells collected from the Pap smear may be precancerous. If the changes are low-grade, the size, shape and other characteristics of the cells suggest that if a precancerous lesion is present, it‘s likely to be years away from becoming a cancer. If the changes are high-grade, there‘s a greater chance that the lesion may develop into cancer much sooner. Diagnostic testing is necessary.
  • Atypical glandular cells. Glandular cells produce mucus and grow in the opening of your cervix and within your uterus. Atypical glandular cells may appear to be slightly abnormal, but it‘s unclear whether they‘re cancerous. Further testing is needed to determine the source of the abnormal cells.
  • Squamous cancer or adenocarcinoma cells. The cells collected for the Pap smear appear so abnormal that the pathologist is almost certain a cancer is present in the vagina, cervix or, occasionally, the uterus. Squamous refers to cancers arising in the flat surface cells of the cervix. Adenocarcinoma refers to cancers arising in glandular cells. If such cells are found, your doctor immediately investigates further.

Upon finding an abnormality, your doctor may decide to examine the tissues through a special microscope in a procedure called colposcopy and take a tissue sample (biopsy). Colposcopy often provides a definitive diagnosis.

Trusting the test results

A Pap smear isn‘t foolproof. You could receive false-negative results. This means that the test indicates that no abnormal cells are present, even though you do have atypical cells. Estimates for the occurrence of false-negative results with a conventional Pap smear vary widely but are at least 5 percent — or one in every 20 women. The liquid-based Pap test provides fewer false-negative results. With either test, false-positive results are extremely rare.

A false-negative result doesn‘t mean that a mistake was made. Many factors can cause a false-negative result, including:

  • An inadequate collection of cells
  • A small number of abnormal cells
  • An inaccessible location of the lesion
  • A small lesion
  • Abnormal cells mimicking benign cells
  • Blood or inflammatory cells obscuring the abnormal cells

Although abnormal cells may go undetected, time is on your side. Cervical cancer takes several years to develop. And if one test doesn‘t detect the abnormal cells, the next test most likely will.

By Mayo Clinic Staff
Mar 10, 2006 © 1998-2008 Mayo Foundation for Medical Education and Research (MFMER). All rights reserved. A single copy of these materials may be reprinted for noncommercial personal use only. "Mayo," "Mayo Clinic," "MayoClinic.com," "EmbodyHealth," "Reliable tools for healthier lives," "Enhance your life," and the triple-shield Mayo Clinic logo are trademarks of Mayo Foundation for Medical Education and Research.







hopeless_dreamer
  Posted: 1/31/2008 9:37 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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What goodbye said is actually true. The trauma of intercourse can lead to abnormal pap smear results in some women. If you tested negative for HPV, then you should have nothing to worry about.

I don‘t use the word trauma here in a negative sense. It‘s just that intercourse does lead to vaginal and cervical epithelial dysplasia, but it‘s nothing to worry about. The body heals within days with no consequence. It was just an issue of timing.


uberbeotch
  Posted: 1/31/2008 11:44 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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I don‘t douche, and I hadn‘t had sex for probably a week or 2 before the May pap. I haven‘t had sex since mid-October, and had the repeat pap in mid-November.

I‘m relieved it‘s not HPV, but I‘m still kind of worried about it....I do meet some of the other high risk criteria. I was a teenager in the Swingin‘ 70‘s, you know! (at least I don‘t smoke any more).

When the doc lets me know what‘s up, I‘ll post here.

UB



Fifi Larue
  Posted: 2/1/2008 11:52 PM Subject: Abnormal Cells
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uberbeotch wrote:

I don‘t douche, and I hadn‘t had sex for probably a week or 2 before the May pap. I haven‘t had sex since mid-October, and had the repeat pap in mid-November.

I‘m relieved it‘s not HPV, but I‘m still kind of worried about it....I do meet some of the other high risk criteria. I was a teenager in the Swingin‘ 70‘s, you know! (at least I don‘t smoke any more).

When the doc lets me know what‘s up, I‘ll post here.

UB



i did have sex the night before, and hubby IS gifted. i hope thats all it was! and i havent douched in many years. i think it throws off our natural PH balance.

and uber, please let us know how it went. i am still curious because, as i said, i NEVER had an abnormal pap before.

who KNEW pussies were gonna be this much trouble!



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